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	<title>Comments on: On China&#8217;s Illegal Wildlife Trade, Ethnocentrism, And Culture</title>
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	<link>http://beijingcream.com/2013/01/on-chinas-illegal-wildlife-trade-ethnocentrism-and-culture/</link>
	<description>A Dollop of China</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Tue, 22 Jan 2019 17:42:34 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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	<item>
		<title>By: rageMeh</title>
		<link>http://beijingcream.com/2013/01/on-chinas-illegal-wildlife-trade-ethnocentrism-and-culture/#comment-216561</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[rageMeh]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 23 Jan 2013 04:37:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://beijingcream.com/?p=9327#comment-216561</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Wasn&#039;t the point that cultures(if cultures why not individuals?) decide right from wrong, and that there is no objective right and wrong?  In which case it seems impossible for the author to hold to this argument while telling others that it is their duty to do the same.
The self-righteous moral relativist chastises others for not being as open-minded, but in doing so places him/herself in a position of moral superiority and destroying the original argument.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wasn&#8217;t the point that cultures(if cultures why not individuals?) decide right from wrong, and that there is no objective right and wrong?  In which case it seems impossible for the author to hold to this argument while telling others that it is their duty to do the same.<br />
The self-righteous moral relativist chastises others for not being as open-minded, but in doing so places him/herself in a position of moral superiority and destroying the original argument.</p>
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		<title>By: M</title>
		<link>http://beijingcream.com/2013/01/on-chinas-illegal-wildlife-trade-ethnocentrism-and-culture/#comment-216478</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[M]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Jan 2013 13:38:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://beijingcream.com/?p=9327#comment-216478</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Yes, I would want to be a part of a blog that would allow some one like me to comment on it.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes, I would want to be a part of a blog that would allow some one like me to comment on it.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: M</title>
		<link>http://beijingcream.com/2013/01/on-chinas-illegal-wildlife-trade-ethnocentrism-and-culture/#comment-216476</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[M]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Jan 2013 11:41:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://beijingcream.com/?p=9327#comment-216476</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[O.K then. Aside from the intestinal dislike some of our readers have for terrior , what have we learnt today?
       Respect of the photo journalist apart all this will do is make a lot of people who already dislike china add ammunition to mental assault rifles as this is fodder made by a westerner, for westerners. This in turn , if such criticism becomes large enough for some Chinese govt employed wu mao to take notice. will just bring about some puff piece about &quot;thos hypocritcal western dicks are picking on us again&quot; BS and nothing will get done. A few people got to puff their little chests out and be angry is all.
      Real change to attitudes in China can only come from the Chinese making these kinds of photo docs,but as the person who raises his voice in china is often heard wailing late at night under a flurry of kicks and blows this will only be done slowly and cautiously.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>O.K then. Aside from the intestinal dislike some of our readers have for terrior , what have we learnt today?<br />
       Respect of the photo journalist apart all this will do is make a lot of people who already dislike china add ammunition to mental assault rifles as this is fodder made by a westerner, for westerners. This in turn , if such criticism becomes large enough for some Chinese govt employed wu mao to take notice. will just bring about some puff piece about &#8220;thos hypocritcal western dicks are picking on us again&#8221; BS and nothing will get done. A few people got to puff their little chests out and be angry is all.<br />
      Real change to attitudes in China can only come from the Chinese making these kinds of photo docs,but as the person who raises his voice in china is often heard wailing late at night under a flurry of kicks and blows this will only be done slowly and cautiously.</p>
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		<title>By: Chackie Jan</title>
		<link>http://beijingcream.com/2013/01/on-chinas-illegal-wildlife-trade-ethnocentrism-and-culture/#comment-216470</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Chackie Jan]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Jan 2013 06:55:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://beijingcream.com/?p=9327#comment-216470</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Excellent comment. Doubt terroir will respond though, as he/she seems to ignore comments that shatter her simplistic view of the world.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Excellent comment. Doubt terroir will respond though, as he/she seems to ignore comments that shatter her simplistic view of the world.</p>
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		<title>By: Jack</title>
		<link>http://beijingcream.com/2013/01/on-chinas-illegal-wildlife-trade-ethnocentrism-and-culture/#comment-216468</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Jack]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Jan 2013 06:27:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://beijingcream.com/?p=9327#comment-216468</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[This man has been documenting animal cruelty in Asia for 20 years... he most likely knows an awful lot about it, and thus is more than &quot;entitled to his opinion&quot; - he should, indeed, be taken very seriously. 

If a Chinese photojournalist had expressed similar sentiments to Brown, would terroir have taken issue with them? I personally don&#039;t feel the ethnic background of a whistleblower, nor their knowledge of the relative merits of TCM (most of which is rooted in totally sustainable herbalism, and not attacked in Brown&#039;s reporting), has any bearing on his findings. He hasn&#039;t plucked his reports out of thin air - they are supported by countless biologists and environmental groups, of countless creeds and ethnic backgrounds, in most countries.

To call Brown ethnocentric, and attempt to discredit his research by making value judgements on his value judgements, is to dodge the far more uncomfortable and far less semantic debate he is trying to force us to have.

Should we, sometimes, sacrifice &quot;culture&quot; for the sake of the biosphere?
 
True, &quot;culture&quot; creates the market for animal parts. A market which now, unlike during the reign of the Yellow Emperor, involves a complex industrial chain and the slaughter of rare and endangered species en masse. Whether or not this is an expression of culture is immaterial when the damage is irreparable and permanent.

TCM was never designed to serve the needs of 1.3bn (much less 7bn and counting), and thus the issue here isn&#039;t its relative effectiveness so much as its impact on the wider environment. Panda brains might cure cancer, or albino narwhal tusks hold the secret to immortality - but nobody is keen to start laboratory testing. 

No tradition should be allowed to stand unquestioned. No researcher, regardless of ethnicity, should have their research dismissed out of hand.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This man has been documenting animal cruelty in Asia for 20 years&#8230; he most likely knows an awful lot about it, and thus is more than &#8220;entitled to his opinion&#8221; &#8211; he should, indeed, be taken very seriously. </p>
<p>If a Chinese photojournalist had expressed similar sentiments to Brown, would terroir have taken issue with them? I personally don&#8217;t feel the ethnic background of a whistleblower, nor their knowledge of the relative merits of TCM (most of which is rooted in totally sustainable herbalism, and not attacked in Brown&#8217;s reporting), has any bearing on his findings. He hasn&#8217;t plucked his reports out of thin air &#8211; they are supported by countless biologists and environmental groups, of countless creeds and ethnic backgrounds, in most countries.</p>
<p>To call Brown ethnocentric, and attempt to discredit his research by making value judgements on his value judgements, is to dodge the far more uncomfortable and far less semantic debate he is trying to force us to have.</p>
<p>Should we, sometimes, sacrifice &#8220;culture&#8221; for the sake of the biosphere?</p>
<p>True, &#8220;culture&#8221; creates the market for animal parts. A market which now, unlike during the reign of the Yellow Emperor, involves a complex industrial chain and the slaughter of rare and endangered species en masse. Whether or not this is an expression of culture is immaterial when the damage is irreparable and permanent.</p>
<p>TCM was never designed to serve the needs of 1.3bn (much less 7bn and counting), and thus the issue here isn&#8217;t its relative effectiveness so much as its impact on the wider environment. Panda brains might cure cancer, or albino narwhal tusks hold the secret to immortality &#8211; but nobody is keen to start laboratory testing. </p>
<p>No tradition should be allowed to stand unquestioned. No researcher, regardless of ethnicity, should have their research dismissed out of hand.</p>
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		<title>By: Dan</title>
		<link>http://beijingcream.com/2013/01/on-chinas-illegal-wildlife-trade-ethnocentrism-and-culture/#comment-216467</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Dan]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Jan 2013 06:14:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://beijingcream.com/?p=9327#comment-216467</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I hate pieces like this. I really do. The author is moralizing against others for moralizing, like a worm devouring its own shit. 

Cruelty to animals is wrong. If that cruelty is culturally entrenched, then it&#039;s a cultural fault that should be spoken out against. It doesn&#039;t matter who speaks out against it, be he &quot;white middle-class&quot; or otherwise. 

Anthony, I suggest you write a rebuttal, because I&#039;m mostly in agreement with the other comments --  if BJC increasingly publishes articles like this, its quality is deteriorating. I&#039;m not interesting in editorials that remind me of freshman year English.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I hate pieces like this. I really do. The author is moralizing against others for moralizing, like a worm devouring its own shit. </p>
<p>Cruelty to animals is wrong. If that cruelty is culturally entrenched, then it&#8217;s a cultural fault that should be spoken out against. It doesn&#8217;t matter who speaks out against it, be he &#8220;white middle-class&#8221; or otherwise. </p>
<p>Anthony, I suggest you write a rebuttal, because I&#8217;m mostly in agreement with the other comments &#8212;  if BJC increasingly publishes articles like this, its quality is deteriorating. I&#8217;m not interesting in editorials that remind me of freshman year English.</p>
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		<title>By: Chackie Jan</title>
		<link>http://beijingcream.com/2013/01/on-chinas-illegal-wildlife-trade-ethnocentrism-and-culture/#comment-216465</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Chackie Jan]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Jan 2013 06:02:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://beijingcream.com/?p=9327#comment-216465</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I find your comment racist in nature and you should feel bad. China is taking good care of pandas so it&#039;s just a small detail that sharks and dolphins are going extinct. Other countries aren&#039;t saving pandas, so they should sit in the corner and be ashamed.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I find your comment racist in nature and you should feel bad. China is taking good care of pandas so it&#8217;s just a small detail that sharks and dolphins are going extinct. Other countries aren&#8217;t saving pandas, so they should sit in the corner and be ashamed.</p>
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		<title>By: Jeff Ward</title>
		<link>http://beijingcream.com/2013/01/on-chinas-illegal-wildlife-trade-ethnocentrism-and-culture/#comment-216463</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Jeff Ward]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Jan 2013 05:29:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://beijingcream.com/?p=9327#comment-216463</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Very disappointing article. The planet is being destroyed and yet the people all over this planet are being asked to be sensitive and silent because a cultural ignorance is wiping us off the planet. China needs to be shamed for the damage being done. China&#039;s own biodiversity is nearly extinct and now they are importing the practices across the planet (rhinos, sharks, and global warming) at a pace that gives little time left. Time for the world to stand against this.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Very disappointing article. The planet is being destroyed and yet the people all over this planet are being asked to be sensitive and silent because a cultural ignorance is wiping us off the planet. China needs to be shamed for the damage being done. China&#8217;s own biodiversity is nearly extinct and now they are importing the practices across the planet (rhinos, sharks, and global warming) at a pace that gives little time left. Time for the world to stand against this.</p>
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		<title>By: wafflestomp</title>
		<link>http://beijingcream.com/2013/01/on-chinas-illegal-wildlife-trade-ethnocentrism-and-culture/#comment-216462</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[wafflestomp]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Jan 2013 05:11:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://beijingcream.com/?p=9327#comment-216462</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&quot;&quot;but labeling Chinese “naive” is to adopt a morally superior position in which the Chinese are “children” who must “grow up” and adopt the moral standard of the West.&#039;&quot;

Morally Chinese people do need to grow up. Sorry Tao. Perhaps not adopt the wests morals but at least stop doing shit like watching women get beat and throwing shit at animals.  

Now if you&#039;ll excuse me I need to shit in my own pool, when in rome eh?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;&#8221;but labeling Chinese “naive” is to adopt a morally superior position in which the Chinese are “children” who must “grow up” and adopt the moral standard of the West.&#8217;&#8221;</p>
<p>Morally Chinese people do need to grow up. Sorry Tao. Perhaps not adopt the wests morals but at least stop doing shit like watching women get beat and throwing shit at animals.  </p>
<p>Now if you&#8217;ll excuse me I need to shit in my own pool, when in rome eh?</p>
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		<title>By: Big Pile O' Fragrant Roses</title>
		<link>http://beijingcream.com/2013/01/on-chinas-illegal-wildlife-trade-ethnocentrism-and-culture/#comment-216460</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Big Pile O' Fragrant Roses]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Jan 2013 02:38:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://beijingcream.com/?p=9327#comment-216460</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[In my culture we kill bloggers who are annoying. That is not a threat, that is culture. Respect it.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In my culture we kill bloggers who are annoying. That is not a threat, that is culture. Respect it.</p>
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		<title>By: Big Pile O' Fragrant Roses</title>
		<link>http://beijingcream.com/2013/01/on-chinas-illegal-wildlife-trade-ethnocentrism-and-culture/#comment-216459</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Big Pile O' Fragrant Roses]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Jan 2013 02:37:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://beijingcream.com/?p=9327#comment-216459</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Fun tip: Write another article on how superior you are. Everyone loves to read that shit.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Fun tip: Write another article on how superior you are. Everyone loves to read that shit.</p>
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		<title>By: WTO</title>
		<link>http://beijingcream.com/2013/01/on-chinas-illegal-wildlife-trade-ethnocentrism-and-culture/#comment-216458</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[WTO]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Jan 2013 02:35:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://beijingcream.com/?p=9327#comment-216458</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[On the one hand there is the need to have respect for culture and then there is also a need to recognize when some things just don&#039;t work in the modern world. 

A British officer in India had this reaction to the Indian practice of Sati (widow-burning):

&quot;Be it so. This burning of widows is your custom; prepare the funeral pile. But my nation has also a custom. When men burn women alive we hang them, and confiscate all their property. My carpenters shall therefore erect gibbets on which to hang all concerned when the widow is consumed. Let us all act according to national customs.&quot;

Sati has some Hindu roots and some say it actually glorified the woman. Possibly, but some things just don&#039;t belong in the 21st century.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>On the one hand there is the need to have respect for culture and then there is also a need to recognize when some things just don&#8217;t work in the modern world. </p>
<p>A British officer in India had this reaction to the Indian practice of Sati (widow-burning):</p>
<p>&#8220;Be it so. This burning of widows is your custom; prepare the funeral pile. But my nation has also a custom. When men burn women alive we hang them, and confiscate all their property. My carpenters shall therefore erect gibbets on which to hang all concerned when the widow is consumed. Let us all act according to national customs.&#8221;</p>
<p>Sati has some Hindu roots and some say it actually glorified the woman. Possibly, but some things just don&#8217;t belong in the 21st century.</p>
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		<title>By: terroir</title>
		<link>http://beijingcream.com/2013/01/on-chinas-illegal-wildlife-trade-ethnocentrism-and-culture/#comment-216457</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[terroir]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Jan 2013 02:26:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://beijingcream.com/?p=9327#comment-216457</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Pig Bile O&#039;,

nah.  Judging from your response, it looks like the term &quot;white middle class&quot;  only refers to the people who care to be offended by the term &quot;white middle class&quot;.  

Fun tip: whole wheat bread is more nutritious than Wonder.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Pig Bile O&#8217;,</p>
<p>nah.  Judging from your response, it looks like the term &#8220;white middle class&#8221;  only refers to the people who care to be offended by the term &#8220;white middle class&#8221;.  </p>
<p>Fun tip: whole wheat bread is more nutritious than Wonder.</p>
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		<title>By: terroir</title>
		<link>http://beijingcream.com/2013/01/on-chinas-illegal-wildlife-trade-ethnocentrism-and-culture/#comment-216455</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[terroir]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Jan 2013 02:18:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://beijingcream.com/?p=9327#comment-216455</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[It&#039;s called &quot;a crusade&quot;.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s called &#8220;a crusade&#8221;.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: terroir</title>
		<link>http://beijingcream.com/2013/01/on-chinas-illegal-wildlife-trade-ethnocentrism-and-culture/#comment-216454</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[terroir]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Jan 2013 02:17:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://beijingcream.com/?p=9327#comment-216454</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&quot;I assume that Mr. Brown is rightfully commenting on the naivety (I would personally call it ignorance) of belief in homeopathic magic&quot;
&quot; in fact vociferously opposed by a majority of the Taiwanese, Hong Kong and overseas Han whom I judge friend&quot;

Traditional Chinese who follow traditional Chinese homeopathic magic = ignorant
The Westernized overseas Chinese who don&#039;t believe in said magic and reach for an aspirin whenever they feel like a character in a pharmaceutical commercial = they whom I(ck) judge friend.

Doesn&#039;t leave much wiggle room.  Based upon your large-scale willingness to nullify a whole culture, you might as well say: 
&quot;Anyone who runs is a V.C.! Anyone who stands still... is a well-disciplined V.C.!&quot;]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;I assume that Mr. Brown is rightfully commenting on the naivety (I would personally call it ignorance) of belief in homeopathic magic&#8221;<br />
&#8221; in fact vociferously opposed by a majority of the Taiwanese, Hong Kong and overseas Han whom I judge friend&#8221;</p>
<p>Traditional Chinese who follow traditional Chinese homeopathic magic = ignorant<br />
The Westernized overseas Chinese who don&#8217;t believe in said magic and reach for an aspirin whenever they feel like a character in a pharmaceutical commercial = they whom I(ck) judge friend.</p>
<p>Doesn&#8217;t leave much wiggle room.  Based upon your large-scale willingness to nullify a whole culture, you might as well say:<br />
&#8220;Anyone who runs is a V.C.! Anyone who stands still&#8230; is a well-disciplined V.C.!&#8221;</p>
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